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Coldstone

Tue, 25 Oct 2005 20:07:50

RambOrc

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/coldstone/">http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/coldstone/</a><!-- m --> not sure about the Winblows download link, Camper found it so ask him if you can't find it. Once you've downloaded it, try to run the program and also try to build the included game and try to run the exe, see whether it all works or whether it crashes. Pls report your findings here.
Tue, 25 Oct 2005 20:32:02

Firebrand

I could only download a ".sit" file, but I don't know how to open it <!-- s:roll: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_rolleyes.gif" alt=":roll:" title="Rolling Eyes" /><!-- s:roll: --> .
Tue, 25 Oct 2005 20:34:16

RambOrc

That's the Mac version (.sit is a StuffIt Archive), ask Camper about the download link to the PC version (or look around the site).
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 10:54:49

RambOrc

Shit, looks like the editor itself is Mac only, the games created with it are compiled for Mac and Winblows. A pity, I found it cool. Camper should evaluate another cross-platform RPG engine, hope he'll finish that soon. Anyway to tell you what it's all about, I have a new idea how to start working on the Korax' Heritage world and story right now even though making SE/TCS right now is pretty much not possible: with some easy-to-use 2D RPG maker, everyone could add little odds and bits into the story and the world, we could release a bunch of mini-RPGs depicting little stories in the world of Kronos, e.g. taking place even before the coming of Korax, making the world even more detailed. The thing is, we've got only one active programmer right now, Firebrand, and I don't want to pull him from KA. But making mini-RPGs with such an RPG maker should require no big knowledge, and the couple of more difficult things (like importing all artwork into such an engine) would be quickly handled with one person on the team who knows how to, after which point everyone could toy around with it and try out ideas. Releasing such little bits now and then parallelly to KA releases could reawaken interest in Korax' Heritage (and belief in us, the team, that we'll ever create anything), and we would also know better what we exactly want to put into Korax' Heritage once we start work on it in earnest.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 13:32:37

Firebrand

I have been seraching for a way to open .sit files, and I found something called Stuffit, there seems to be a port of that thing for Winblows, I'll install it and try to open the files when I have some more time. It coule make it easier for everyone to use that thing <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:33:49

RambOrc

You can see what can be done with Coldstone by downloading the Winblows demo of the game they made with it ( <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/pog/">http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/pog/</a><!-- m --> ), I liked the look & feel, making such a game would make it possible for us to concentrate solely on story and world because we already have the artwork (I think Hexen/KA/SE artwork can be ported over pretty fast), the music and the game engine, hence no programmers, musicians or artists would be needed (or very little), enabling everyone on the team with ideas to try and present them. And this way we could give the fans something RPG before 2007... <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:55:46

Firebrand

I couldn't make it work, I could expand the .sit file, but the format of what I think are the executable files is not recognized by winblows, too bad, because from the screenshots of the web page it seems to be really nice, I doubt we can find something as easy as this for winblows, heh! <!-- s:? --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" /><!-- s:? -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 15:34:56

The 4th Class

[quote="RambOrc":2twrxsnr]You can see what can be done with Coldstone by downloading the Winblows demo of the game they made with it ( <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/pog/">http://www.ambrosiasw.com/games/pog/</a><!-- m --> ), I liked the look & feel, making such a game would make it possible for us to concentrate solely on story and world because we already have the artwork (I think Hexen/KA/SE artwork can be ported over pretty fast), the music and the game engine, hence no programmers, [color=black:2twrxsnr][size=150:2twrxsnr][u:2twrxsnr]musicians[/u:2twrxsnr][/size:2twrxsnr][/color:2twrxsnr] or artists would be needed (or very little), enabling everyone on the team with ideas to try and present them. And this way we could give the fans something RPG before 2007... <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) --> Great, now I'm gonna be layed off. <!-- s:roll: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_rolleyes.gif" alt=":roll:" title="Rolling Eyes" /><!-- s:roll: --> j/k Seriously, and I'm really sorry to say this RambOrc, but this is a team effort and I'm entitled to sharing my bite of the biscuit: I can't help but feel this is taking the easy way out. I mean sure, this enables us to focus solely on plot and story, which has been solely dragged behind in all this time, but I certainly don't want the additional resources (goodies that come with Coldstone) substituting our years of patience and dedication. I know I'm greatly exaggerating this, but I worry that our hard work with the artwork, music, programming, and possibly mapping will be for nothing. And who knows? Doomsworld lost to Vavoom which is now threatened by Coldstone. What's stopping a potential Coldstone successor, starting the viscious start-from-scratch cycle again? That's just how I feel. Most likely I'm taking an extremist view, but it's a view nonetheless. Promise none of our 4 years of hard work will go to waste, and my opinion on this may change.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 15:54:08

RambOrc

Looks like a 100% misunderstanding, so let me try it in a bit different way: when making such a mini-RPG, we can concentrate on the story and world, because - we don't need an extra musician post because we already have the music for SE, meaning all is needed to done is to pick one for a map and that's it - we don't need an artist team because we already have the artwork created for SE, due to us using an old sprite engine all our characters (and for that matter, textures and scenery and etc) are in the form of small sprites that can be put 1:1 into such a 2D game (which wouldn't be possible if we'd use a modern engine with 3D models, highres textures and the like) - we don't need programmers for this because the game engine already has the built-in code that allows us to place objects into a map and add events and convos with a GUI without programming This does NOT mean scrapping SE, indeed this is IMO making SE more tangible because people won't give up completely on us (and those who did might re-evaluate their conclusions) since it'll be obvious we still care about an epic RPG in the world of Kronos. And unlike posting screenshots about work in progress, this way the fans do have something at hand, they can have their say in how the world should be etc. Is it more clear now? <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> p.s. Doomsday was ditched in favor of Vavoom mostly because of two things: the more advanced engine of Vavoom with features I absolutely wanted (like 3D floors, skyboxes and the like) and because of the nonexistant developer support for Doomsday. SkyJake never cared a cent about KMOD and how it could be ported in any newer version of Doomsday than 0.99.6. In contrast, Janis has implemented features into mainstream Vavoom just because I or someone else asked him, and if you scan through the KA internal testing you'll see he helped Firebrand solve coding problems. Camper tried the same with SkyJake back in 2001 with no tangible results.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 15:59:48

The 4th Class

A bit, yes. Sorry about the tantrum. <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 16:03:38

RambOrc

[quote="Firebrand":tolrfuva]I couldn't make it work, I could expand the .sit file, but the format of what I think are the executable files is not recognized by winblows, too bad, because from the screenshots of the web page it seems to be really nice, I doubt we can find something as easy as this for winblows, heh! <!-- s:? --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" /><!-- s:? --> Is there no Mac emulator for Winblows like there are Winblows and DOS emulators for Mac? All you'd need is a Mac OS Classic (8 or 9) emulator because Coldstone has both ports (and I use the Classic version anyway because the OS X port crashes all the time). At any rate, it doesn't have to be Coldstone, all the requirements are easy editing and if I am to work on it too than Mac support (else it can be a PC-only version where only the rest of the team can work with it excluding me and Camper, which is still a good thing, that'd still mean several people with good ideas). At any rate, Camper is theoretically testing a Java-based RPG maker which I found on the web, Java is OS independent meaning both the editor as well as the playable game should work on not only Winblows and Mac but also on GNU/Linux and other platforms.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 16:06:40

RambOrc

[quote="The 4th Class":9yaojnuq]A bit, yes. Sorry about the tantrum. <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> Well then ask away until it's perfectly clear. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 16:19:22

RambOrc

Of course there are emulators that let you run Mac apps on your PC! 2 seconds into Google I found this: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.emulators.com/softmac.htm">http://www.emulators.com/softmac.htm</a><!-- m -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 16:30:47

Firebrand

I think we could use Coldstone to make a precuel to SE (before Korax comes to the land of Kronos), that would be cool! Also, we could work just on a medium sized game, that way we would give enough time to work on the engine which is the most important thing to start our work on SE (RPG system, shops, convos, etc. adding them to the actual Vavoom build), I don't know how much time it would take to make the game in Coldstone and work in the engine at the same time, lol, but I think it will be worth the effort, besides, if we use the resoruces we actually have, we will be able to focus more in creating the story and consider smaller details developing this thingy, what do you think of this?
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 16:57:54

RambOrc

Yep, exactly my way of thinking, with a couple of minor adjustments: - at least in the first run, we could just make mini-RPG with maybe 2-3 maps, 1-2 NPCs, a dozen monsters and a total play time of 20 minutes, such mini-RPG could be created fast and thus testing cycles would be faster, both internally and externally. It'd be like a book consisting of dozens of short stories instead of one big one, while there isn't that much depth to story and characters, you see lots of snapshots of the world and you get a feeling how the world is and stuff all the same - the coding part for SE isn't the only huge thing to be finished. Unless we either reduce the number of maps to a very low number (like 20) or we content ourselves with very basic architecture, it'll take a VERY long time to build the world in Vavoom. Already establishing locations in a retro 2D engine, seeing which excites our (and the fans') fantasy most, we could expand upon them. It'd be like a book or a comic from which we would build the game in the end. - another benefit I just realized, we could completely test out the whole shopping/economic system for example, because shops and stuff would be pretty much the same in both RPG types. Maybe even EXP, quests, convos and the like could have so many similarities that we could find out what's the best way to interact and thus know what exactly we want for TCS/SE/TSP.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 17:02:26

Firebrand

I have seen that MacSoft software you have recommended, but it appears that you need a Mac BIOS to use it, there's a Mac BIOS dumping util on their page that might give us the solution for all of us, but we will obviously that you or Camper dump the BIOS to a file so we can use the emulator, it also seems a bit complicated to configure, but every emulator has the same problem, heh! <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->. Hope you can dump the BIOS file. Now, returning to the topic of the development, I think that having the codebase will make it easier for everyone to think on how to build the maps and make use of the new features that we'll have with the base engine (I mean, that way we will know which types of monsters to place on the very beginning of the game, how powerfull the player is at a given EXP level, how many enemies we'll have, and other things like that), making the use of the engine stuff better for our needs and our ideas of course <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 20:25:31

The 4th Class

[quote="RambOrc":p9veeqxb]Well then ask away until it's perfectly clear. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> When you say we don't need any artist team, etc., it's because we've already contributed enough work? <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 20:49:41

RambOrc

Yep, that was the whole point, using a dumb retro 2D engine we already have more than enough artwork to start out at once.
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 20:57:42

The 4th Class

BTW, when are you ever going to update the development history page? After all, a lot has happened since June 2003. <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 21:00:26

RambOrc

In case you missed it, quite some time ago Firebrand and Janis took over the website management and webmastering, so ask them not me. <!-- s:idea: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_idea.gif" alt=":idea:" title="Idea" /><!-- s:idea: -->
Wed, 26 Oct 2005 21:12:14

The 4th Class

Firebrand and Janis, when are you ever going to update the development history page? After all, a lot has happened since June 2003. <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P -->
Thu, 27 Oct 2005 13:30:07

Firebrand

[quote="RambOrc":3vj2a4nm]In case you missed it, quite some time ago Firebrand and Janis took over the website management and webmastering, so ask them not me. <!-- s:idea: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_idea.gif" alt=":idea:" title="Idea" /><!-- s:idea: --> Thank you for remembering it to me, heh! <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P --> [quote="The 4th Class":3vj2a4nm]Firebrand and Janis, when are you ever going to update the development history page? After all, a lot has happened since June 2003. Uhh... I have been working a bit on the new web page design, I haven't been able to complete it, this week I won't have much time, so expect something for the next few weeks, heh! <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->. When the new site design is finished Ramborc will install a new CMS for the site and everyone will be able to help updating the info on every one of our projects by the use of the new CMS, then when the site is completely updated, maybe a new version of KA will be around the corner and that will be the first major update for our projects <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D -->. So you can start thinking what you will be adding for the Development History 4th, hehe! <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P -->.
Fri, 28 Oct 2005 13:08:13

The 4th Class

You'll have 2 years worth of blueprints by Monday. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->
Mon, 31 Oct 2005 03:27:17

The 4th Class

Make that next monday. <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 14:38:29

The 4th Class

RambOrc are you still in favour of implementing Coldstone into SE and TSP, or was that a hype of the past? <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 15:41:38

RambOrc

Huh? No, that was just an idea and long abandoned. Even though the basic idea, regardless of Coldstone, isn't bad, releasing a couple of little mini-games that are done in a couple of hours. We can do it any time in the future too, it'd be like LucasArts who while working on Episode 3 released those two low-budget crappy cartoons to fill the story between Episode 2 and 3. <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 16:36:11

Crimson Wizard

What's Coldstone?
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 19:16:03

Firebrand

[quote="Crimson Wizard":3e6g73ue]What's Coldstone? Why don't you read the whole thread? <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P --> [quote="The 4th Class":3e6g73ue]You'll have 2 years worth of blueprints by Monday. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> I wonder if you are still working on this <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P -->.
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 21:46:11

The 4th Class

Still want it? It'll have to wait until Monday though. <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P -->
Sat, 02 Sep 2006 23:06:28

Firebrand

Sure! Now it's the right time to give me a hand with it, since I'm making some site maintenance now that I have the time (my vacations will end soon, and who know when I'll be free again <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( -->).
Sun, 03 Sep 2006 03:33:32

The 4th Class

Okay, well you asked for it. <!-- s:P --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s:P --> This is all I could come up at the moment; I don't really have enough time to go into extensive research. If you have more, then that's great. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> 2003 October - Col JP quits Ravenforums due to the Kingdom Of Fuck controversy (this is possibly irrelevant) November - Nightwolf joins December - The 4th Class joins 2004 - Stryker, DarkRaven, and madPaul join (though the order I can't remember, it's too much research than it's worth at any rate) - KMod 3.0 is released (KM2.8 is last of the 2.x series) - First KA beta testing 2005 February - Second KA beta testing September - The blog is started November - KA trailer released - Rolls and Herr Jaquboss join - RambOrc ceases to be site manager, giving power to Firebrand 2006 August - Crimson Wizard, Alex Bomberman, and Mordy join
Sun, 03 Sep 2006 10:33:50

Crimson Wizard

Hey-hey! Who said I joined in August? <!-- s:o --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_surprised.gif" alt=":o" title="Surprised" /><!-- s:o --> No way, Lucas, I joined in April!!! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> (or in the beginning of May... well, but not later) EDIT: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.korax-heritage.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=15237#15237">http://www.korax-heritage.com/forums/vi ... 5237#15237</a><!-- m --> it was 15th April exactly Well, uhm, lemme guess, Coldstone is a sort of engine for 2d RPG making?
Sun, 03 Sep 2006 14:58:49

Firebrand

Yes, to both affirmations <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->. Nice work so far 4th Class, now I only need to think how I will structure all this info to merger it to what we got now <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->.
Sun, 03 Sep 2006 18:30:58

The 4th Class

Just talk a lot. <!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: -->

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